I’ve listed articles full of facts that conclude that lockdowns and masks work. Now the conclusions boil down to highly-regarded opinions backed up by facts. I’m done playing your game.
You're wrong. You don't even read what I write or show you understand what I write. You just repeat over and over again that it's "all opinions" when you really don't know that.
The conclusions I share are backed up by facts, like this one about lockdowns working:
Governments around the world are responding to the coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) pandemic, caused by severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus(SARS-CoV-2), with unprecedented policies designed to slow the growth rate of infections. Many policies, such as closing schools and restricting populations to their homes, impose large and visible costs on society; however, their benefits cannot be directly observed and are currently understood only through process-based simulations . Here we compile data on 1,700 local, regional and national
non-pharmaceutical interventions that were deployed in the ongoing pandemic across localities in China, South Korea, Italy, Iran, France and the United States. We then apply reduced-form econometric methods, commonly used to measure the effect of policies on economic growth, to empirically evaluate the effect that these anti-contagion policies have had on the growth rate of infections. In the absence of policy actions, we estimate that early infections of COVID-19 exhibit exponential growth rates of approximately 38% per day. We find that anti-contagion policies have significantly and substantially slowed this growth. Some policies have different effects on different populations, but we obtain consistent evidence that the policy packages that were deployed to reduce the rate of transmission achieved large, beneficial and measurable health outcomes. We estimate that across these 6 countries, interventions prevented or delayed on the order of 61 million confirmed cases, corresponding to averting approximately 495 million total infections. These findings may help to inform decisions regarding whether or when these policies should be deployed, intensified or lifted, and they can support policy-making in the more than 180 other countries in which COVID-19 has been reported."
But by that same logic, banning all motor vehicles will definitely slow vehicular fatalities.
Banning all ladders will help reduce the number of fatal falls from elevation.
Banning people from taking showers will reduce the number of slips and falls in showers.
Banning airplanes will definitely stop the number of airplane crashes and fatalities.
Yep, just keep shutting down, banning and eliminating.....back to horse and buggy and one story buildings."
Apples and oranges. We don't have mass casualty events emanating from any of these problems.
Also when it comes to vehicular fatalities, we have over 100,000,000 cars on the road every day. Only 102 deaths. The risk of dying is 0.000102%, many orders of magnitude less than dying from COVID. And a car accident isn't going to make more car accidents more likely in the same way that COVID infections make other COVID infections more likely.
The virus is coming back with a vengeance. Connecticut has already locked down more today.
After suffering with this pandemic for months, I’m going to finally agree with the conservatives on this:
If you’re dumb enough not to understand the dangers of catching this virus, then maybe it’s ok if you catch it. Sure, you and your family and friends may die from it, or they may not and suffer permanent damage, but fuck it...that’s a risk that y’all can take.
But be nice enough to stay away from me, my family, and my friends. Because I care about my health and there’s.
Masks are proven to work to prevent the spread of infection.
Social isolation obviously works in preventing the spread.
Yes, most younger people will not suffer most (if not all) of the deleterious effects of the virus, but those young people can infect their family and friends who can die or be seriously hurt from it.
No one wants a complete shutdown and it isn’t necessary if most people take precautions to prevent the spread.
Remember, had we been diligent in preventing the spread of the virus, we would have opened up our economy sooner and more safely. Sure their will be more waves of the virus, but the numbers of infections would be significantly less than what we are experiencing now.
Bad leadership caused this.
Fuck Trump and his stupid, shortsighted followers.
“ Ban cigarettes that will save 480,000 Americans a year. ”
There isn’t the political will to do what you suggest. It’s unconstitutional even though it would save lives. And one person smoking a cigarette doesn’t affect the rest of the population as much as one person getting the highly contagious COVID, even if you consider second-hand smoking.
Just saying death is death. They all matter.
So let's get in gear. I ain't lying or accusing you of anything.
Stop taking it personal.
My comment is in general.
^The Ionnaidis information is old, before evidence came out that lockdowns may have worked. It’s more accurate to say the lockdowns were done when the data was uncertain, but even Ionnaidis admitted to be isolating from society during this time. In a scenario full of uncertainty, you should assume worst case scenario and take precautions. And we did with the lockdowns.
Most scientists and epidemiologists don’t agree with the Great Barrington Declaration. It got a lot of fanfare from the right-wing press.
Thought we locked down for a month back in March....at least here in CA we did...or did you already forget that.....sounding like YOU have the Biden syndrome....LOL.
I mean at least with Europe, new cases went down to basal levels. With Trump at the helm, new cases never got close. And that leads to more hospitalizations and deaths.
The EU as a total tests as much as we do at least during the time when their new cases were low and ours weren’t . I checked. And their population is only 1.25 times ours.
New cases never rose much jazz because of I’m the actions of our governor. But that doesn’t mean repeat waves aren’t coming, where you have to lockdown again. And we will, probably.
But you already said if we locked down for a month, we would be ok....we can keep locking down and I bet you will still be saying lock down a year from now.
So I spoke with a doctor this weekend about Covid, and he said the following:
People don't understand who bad it's going to get.
It is going to be really, really bad.
People don't understand how the flue spreads.
People are going to start relaxing their safety measures because how how inconvenienced they've been over the past few months. And THAT is going to cause an explosion of new cases.
@Granite
Every country is going to experience an increase in cases during the winter and that was always anticipated.
But the severity and length of the lockdown is determined by how well a country has handled it's safety measures and its contact trace testing.
Lastly, rather than see this as an invisible enemy, think of it as an earthquake. You can prepare and be diligent, yet your house can still be destroyed despite your preparation and precautions. But I definitely wouldn't want to live in an unstable structure, I'd like to do what I can to be safe and deal with it when it occurs, and I would want to have provisions to tide me over.
Similaarly, people already know there is a disaster here among us. Not taking precautions is simply stupid and irresponsible. People should expect to be inconvenienced. But better be inconvenienced than potentially kill family members or suffer from potentially permanent neurological damage.
800,000 to a million US deaths from COVID is mass murder.
A strategy of trying to get to herd immunity without a vaccine for a disease where people can get reinfected and possibly be sicker the second time is mass murder.
Ask William Haseltine, an epidemiologist from Harvard.
According to the latest numbers from CDC, we are at 230,000. New daily was at 451 today. Even at 900 which was a few days ago, we won't get to your numbers for nearly 2 years....
"nationwide testing would be a much better option, and we could open up the economy too"
no duhhh....gee.
but our dip shit leadership would rather focus
in defense versus offense in this battle. Zero
representation that are true proactive leaders and offering the general public
something / ANYTHING better than a lock down scenario.
For those who actually need a job and can make a living
By interacting with people versus staying indoors and die a sloooowww death economically
"Hey kit car guy, how many total deaths this year compared to the last several years?"
Your question suggests that you aren't comprehending the problem.
The common flu typically kills 12,000 to 61,000 deaths, depending on the year. Covid-19 is predicted to kill 400,000 Americans by the end of this year. Since deaths started in March/April of this year, 500,000/year could be a more accurate yearly death rate for Covid-19 if we continue on the irresponsible path created by Trump.
But the common flu doesn't typically cause severe issues in those who survive it. If you have a bad case of Covid-19 and it doesn't kill you, you can still suffer from permanent damage to your heart, brain, and lungs. The lasting neurological issues are substantial.
If 95% of Americans socially distanced and wore masks, coupled with an effective testing program our economy will open up and a lockdown would be unnecessary.
I agree a lockdown is a "last-resort" solution, but social gatherings at restaurants, bars, sporting events, movie theaters, etc., must be restricted. The rest of the economy can open up relatively easily, but people need to strictly take precautions.
Allowing "herd immunity" is pure stupidity. There would be millions of deaths. Even the health minister of Sweden admitted the country was wrong in seeking herd immunity:
"Coronavirus: Futile and immoral to seek herd immunity, says Swedens chief epidemiologist"
Well the fact is that it's here and it's not going away any time soon. You can't lock down the country, or the world, for months at a time unless the government is willing to forgive mortgage & rent payments, give out free food, free electricity & natural gas etc etc.
The alternative is to take as many precautions as humanely possible and get on with our lives.
And you act like europeans are just going into lock down willingly ... they ain't. Just look at this vid.
"Hey kit car guy, how many total deaths this year compared to the last several years?"
Your question suggests that you aren't comprehending the problem.
The common flu typically kills 12,000 to 61,000 deaths, depending on the year. Covid-19 is predicted to kill 400,000 Americans by the end of this year. Since deaths started in March/April of this year, 500,000/year could be a more accurate yearly death rate for Covid-19 if we continue on the irresponsible path created by Trump.
But the common flu doesn't typically cause severe issues in those who survive it. If you have a bad case of Covid-19 and it doesn't kill you, you can still suffer from permanent damage to your heart, brain, and lungs. The lasting neurological issues are substantial.
You too are able to express your opinions... Ain't America Great!
"[A CDC] report reviewed deaths from Jan. 26 to Oct. 3 of 2020, and used modeling to compare the weekly tallies with those of corresponding weeks in 2015 through 2019.
The researchers estimated that 299,028 more people than expected died in the United States during that period, with 198,081 deaths attributable to Covid-19 and the rest to other causes.
That estimate is significantly higher than the 216,025 coronavirus deaths officially reported by the C.D.C. as of Oct. 15."
I just looked at some data on IHME, and they predict that Europe will go through a lot worse epidemic this winter relative to their original epidemic than we will relative to our first.
Interesting.
That could possibly be due to us acquiring more immunity over the several months by not being as closed.
That would be a silver lining to the policies that Trump and Republican governors have had by not closing things as much.
But then countries in Asia and New Zealand that test, trace, and quarantine well are still doing much better than either us or Europe.
