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Ya know different guns have different applications. A rifle tends to be more accurate and deadly... if you are trying to stop a Church shooter from a distance I kinda don't want you using a handgun .... an AR-15 on the other hand will stop the guy and save us the cost of a trial.
Keep the weapons out of the hands of insane people yes. Prevent people from having effective self defense no.
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So you actually do have a one inch dick. I thought I was only kidding.
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mbc2000, you know nothing about guns and ammo! ).gif)
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HeyTheyCallMeMicroPeen projecting again
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what a crock - 60 minutes has no credibility at all.
The damage depends on velocity and slug size - remember E = mc 2
For close range self defense my go to is a 45c 1911 - is maybe a little slower than other rounds, but one round put them down
And for home defense there is nothing like the sound of racking a Remington 870 12-gauge to make the intruder shit their pants - and you won't tear up your neighbor's refrigerator if you miss the 1st time
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Kinetic energy of the projectile is (1/2)mv^2
It is based the mass (m) and velocity
(v) of the projectile and has nothing to do with the speed of light.
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And ... let's not forget that the force a bullet hits its target is: F = ma
i.e. mass of bullet x acceleration of the bullet - either positive or negative.
'And for home defense there is nothing like the sound of racking a Remington 870 12-gauge'
Yup. Knowing you're going up against something that will cut you in half has a tendency to give people pause.
Atticus Finch
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FaceDownAssUp, I agree, to a point. 12 ga pump with a riot gun barrel (18" in CA) is the best home defensive weapon. However, you do have to pay attention to the ammo. I once had an accidental discharge inside my house with a 12 ga, 18" barrel, loaded with No. 2 Buckshot. The round went all the way through the roof, made a 90 degree turn and went across the street and almost hit an off-duty policeman that was standing on his front porch. No drama with him, he simply said, "Was that you?" To which I confessed. He then said, "Don't sweat, it happens to us all the time in the PD parking lot."
Since that accident, I always make sure to load dove load (#8). At close range it will take down any intruder, but as it hits the drywall it will dissipate energy quickly and be totally non-lethal by the time it gets to the neighbor's house.
It's a real bummer when you shoot at an intruder, only to hit your neighbor by accident!
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Personally, I'm a fan of high base #6 or #7 1/2.
Goes thru drywall to fuck that bitch up but won't go thru siding or stucco.
Once you get to #4, you might have a neighbor problem.
If it's a double barrel, I'd go with #6 first shot to slow 'em down.
Then a high base single slug to the head for the "Goodnight Irene" shot.
Get a good mop and plenty of rags, though.
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Comparing a handgun to a rifle is total bullshit to begin with. 60 Minutes is a hack show with people who know nothing about the subject they are reviewing and whatever 'expert' they grab, with whatever political agenda they want to display.
Handgun muzzle velocities generally run from about 750 FPS (feet per second) to 1,300 FPS. Rifle velocities generally run from 1,900 FPS to 4,000 FPS.
So the impact forces will always be greater with a rifle than a handgun at the same distance.
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Jazz, you are absolutely correct.
Most people know diddily about guns and ammo.
Hand guns have the advantage of portability, concealment, and quick access.
Compared to a rifle or shotgun, handguns are woefully underpowered, and difficult to shoot accurately.
That little .223/5.65mm as used in the AR15 / M16 / M4. Is not only a fast mover, but also fragments at the cannelure causing significant tissue damage.
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My handgun bullets travel at 186,000mps
So, let's see......carry the one, divide by the angle of the dangle
Complete conversion of mass to energy
Yep, that's a nucular bomb going off in your liver so you're basically a mini-sun shining for a nano-second.
Yes, I do my own reloads with dilithium crystals for that Warp Factor 1 velocity.
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mcfly88 is so gay, he just throws chaulk at people.
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I don't know shit about guns. I know a hand gun would be a weapon of last resort for self defense.
An AR-15 would be an intimidating weapon for home defense but it's clearly too powerful for home.
If I ever felt a need for some kind of weapon for home I'd go for a pump action shotgun. I figure just hearing a shotgun being pumped is intimidating.
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Especially when a pig is pointing it at you.
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That old tired 60 Minutes segment not only tried to demonize a perfectly legitimate firearm, they spent most of the time demonizing the .223 Remington/5.56 NATO ammunition. Yes it's fast and tumbles/fragments and all that shit, but do a segment on the 30.06 or 12 GA loaded with 00 buck and let's see that block of ballistic gel get really shredded.
Haywood 
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Are we talking mass murder?
The Sagamihara stabbings were committed on 26 July 2016 in Midori Ward, Sagamihara, Kanagawa, Japan. Nineteen people were killed and twenty-six others were injured, thirteen severely, at a care home for disabled people.
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On the evening of 14 July 2016, a 19-tonne cargo truck was deliberately driven into crowds of people celebrating Bastille Day on the Promenade des Anglais in Nice, France, resulting in the deaths of 86 people and the injury of 458 others.
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A group of eight knife-wielding terrorists attacked passengers in the Kunming Railway Station in Kunming, Yunnan, China, on 1 March 2014. The attackers pulled out long-bladed knives and stabbed and slashed passengers at random. The assailants killed 31 civilians and injured more than 140 people.
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The Oklahoma City bombing was a domestic terrorist truck bombing of the Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, United States, on April 19, 1995. Wikipedia
Date: April 19, 1995
Number of deaths: 168
Injured: 680+
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During the September 11, 2001 attacks, 2,977 people were killed, 19 hijackers committed murder–suicide, and more than 6,000 others were injured. Of the 2,996 total deaths (including the terrorists), 2,763 were in the World Trade Center and the surrounding area, 189 were at the Pentagon, and 44 were in Pennsylvania.
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Meanwhile it's another typical weekend in Chicago...
40 people shot just over this weekend alone with 6 dead.
This in a city with some of the strictest gun laws on the books.
NRA members are not the problem.
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Shhhhh, don't let HeyBoneMeDeepAndHard hear you.
"Every bad thing that happens has a ready-made solution in the form of a new government program, tax or regulation. To paraphrase what an ambitious Progressive once said: Never let a tragedy go to waste."
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^ That's right.
Latest bad thing to happen is Frauline Pelosi's husband had a car accident and was arrested for DUI. It clearly runs in the family.
Will they ban normal cars and make us go to electric vehicles?
Or ban liquor and have Pelosi operating in a semi coherent state?
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Let's just hope she gets taken out by a ricochet.
Who gives a fuck anyway.
As of November, she's out and will likely not run again.
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@jackrabbitt
Your wheezing about Chicago makes me think you've never verified a piece of information in your life. There's guns in Chicago, but they don't come from Chicago.
People have cars you know... they don't just hop around on 2 feet.
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From the attached link...
"Chicago Memorial Day shootings 2022: 47 shot, 9 fatally, in holiday weekend violence across city, police say | abc7chicago.com"
That's not me wheezing... I'm just giving the news.
But in the case of Chicago it's more like "same shit, different day."
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The point is all the stupid gun control legislation in the world wont stop criminals from having guns as long as Progressives are in charge at the DA's office.
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I heard the tally in Chicago for this fine weekend was around 52 shot with 10 dead...........
But, yeah......let's pass some more laws, that'll stop those fuckers
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sorry people buts not about the gun, well thats not entirely true i guess but it is mostly true.
from what i understand in australia or NZ they have been able to ban all guns and remove the mass shooter scenario completely.
so yes that is an option.
however in US that would be similar to removing all cars to curb drunk driving.
the difference is that in US, guns are like air - we need them and they are required according to the constitution. so no we cannot remove guns - its just not possible.
what other variables are there?
make the schools safe, no i mean really safe.
if you have ever traveled to Switzerland or to srael or gone to a Jewish private elementary school or community center, then you know what i am talking about - they protect.
cameras, armed guards, metal detectors/scanning etc etc.
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investment and jobs
maybe share a few clips of the shooters being shot 100 times from the legs up...get some good sound going
hardening all places is the NEW reality...has been for last 10 years
people going to concerts, churches, and schools...need to fork over a few more bucks for security...like at the airport
red states can train about 10-12 people in their schools with handguns(sure more of them will be volunteering or might just quit without that option)...get access to these guns in a secure box...maybe need two keys to open the box. that would save serious time. typically takes cops over 5min to respond...if at all
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lapierre is right about Jewish places.
I used to swim early mornings a few days a week at the Jewish Community Center before going to work.
Armed guards at all entry points.
Deterrence works. Complacency will be overrun.
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Well, I was shocked by the real world stats:
Most gun-related deaths—54% in 2020—are suicides. Mass shooting casualties are less than 1% of all gun deaths, and there have been 13 mass school shootings since 1966.
There are an estimated 400 million guns in circulation in the U.S., which leads gun-control advocates to conclude that school shootings are an inevitable outcome of having so many guns around. Correlation is not causation, however, and research has failed to find a causal relationship between changes in gun-ownership rates and changes in the level of school violence involving firearms. A recent analysis of the Rand Corporation’s firearms database by the University of Oklahoma’s Daniel Hamlin found significant increases and decreases in school gun incidents during periods when gun-ownership rates remained relatively stable.
Gun-ownership rates in rural areas are higher than in urban areas, yet our cities tend to be far more violent. Whites own firearms at much higher rates than blacks or Hispanics, yet gun violence among the latter two groups is much more commonplace. Moreover, proponents of additional gun laws ignore that shootings continue to plague places such as Chicago, which already has some of the country’s most severe gun restrictions. How passing more gun regulations, or taking guns away from the law-abiding, will deter criminals is a question they can’t answer.
Russia and Mexico have stronger gun-control laws than we do as well as higher homicide rates.
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Here's the really scary part..........
Rates of functional mental illness are high in open societies and low in authoritarian ones.
And, getting worse every year.
The epidemic rates of mental illness, even if taken at the 2007 measurement of incidence among adults aged 18 to 54 as 20%, means that 1 in 5 American adults at any point in time are likely to be irrational. That is, their judgments would be erroneous and subjective, reflecting their psychological condition and not objective reality.
The more a society is dedicated to the value of equality and the more choices it offers for individual self-determination, the higher its rates of functional mental illness. These rates increase in parallel with the increase in the available occupational, geographical, religious, gender and lifestyle-related choices. This explains why, since the 1970s, the U.S. leads the world as the country most affected by functional mental illness, though other prosperous liberal democracies aren’t far behind.
How the hell does our society remain free and democratic, yet not be overrun by functional mental illness. We need to figure this out........and soon.
Otherwise Gloom guy will be having a field day.
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The spineless Republicans are owned by the gun lobby. What sick fuck promotes gun ownership after 19 children were massacred.
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^^^^ Uh, I do
Just like the government, and liberals always do.. Blame the weapon, not the individual using it.
We have a problem, but taking guns away from the responsible, will not take them away from criminals.
This individual would have found another weapon, such a car, and killed as many.
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I thought this video from MedCram was a good look at the data behind gun violence. These incidents are basically suicides so focusing on gun restrictions ignores their cries for help.
https://youtu.be/sO5W9vk55w4
The alignment with suicides and mental illness are pretty stark. He suggests isolation and social media as contributors but I think he should also look at usage of psych meds. Why boys and not girls? why mostly white and not in Compton or East LA?
I like the TelTec sub2000...accuray of a rifle, 9mm glock mags, and folds into my backpack, jic
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yea @Mbc2000, you do not know shit about guns
the idea of what gun is appropriate or inappropriate for a home defense situation is dependent on the area that you live in.
An ar-15 would be a great home defense weapon if you live in a home and there is some distance between you and your neighbors. It also depends on the kind of caliber of bullet and the grain of the bullet as well, as well as barrel length. Also the type of structures in your surrounding area also matter as you have to take into account bullet penetration as well as richocets.
In an apartment or heavy urban area you will want something with less penetration, so that could be 9mm or a shotgun.
And then there are the stupid gun laws in certain places (like california) that will make it difficult for you to have a proper setup for home defense. for example the optimum barrel size for the 9mm is between 6 inchs and 7 1/2 inches. and it would be most controllable out of a carbine type setup. Unfortunately for you in cali that is illegal. You would have to go with a carbine with a 16 inch barrel.
Also any bullet will do the job if they hit at the right spot. Funny thing is they want to go after 9mm and 5.56/2.23 because those are the most common rounds. Even thou there are rounds far more lethal than those 2 rounds.
The whole issue is not about safety, its about those in power wanting more power at the expense of your rights.
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considering the opening comment didn't have a personal take on the clip?
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I like this guy.
He presents some good info, and demonstrates, how different projectiles, penetrate various barriers.
He has quite a few videos, on various firearm subjects.
The link, and video, is just one of many.
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Good afternoon gentlemen & intelligent people,
Thank you for the refreshers course in the Laws of Physics concerning, Kinetic Energy, impact & momentum. The Laws of Physics are the only universally reliable truth on our current planet.
We can all agree that being hit by a projectile travelling at high velocity (it is more appropriate to use the term velocity - It's a vector, it has direction & magnitude, as opposed to speed - it has magnitude only, no direction) is harmful & can be very fatal.
We can all also agree, past events & history of bad & mentally disturbed people have inflected harm & caused fatality by using other deadly implements.
Eg.
Sharpe Objects (ie. Knives & swards), Explosives (Homemade & otherwise), Incendiaries (homemade cocktail of petroleum / flammable products), cars, vans, hard objects (baseball bats) .....etc.
You get the idea & they were listed & cited in the blogs above.
The problem is & will always be.......
'When a person or a group of people are hell bent on inflicting harm on other human, nothing can prevent them from committing the heinous & inhuman act'
It is not the implement (firearms in our current discussion) that are deadly. It is the minds of these extremely bad people who are the mastermind of crime. We need to banish these BAD and or Mentally INSANE PEOPLE. Not the tools, they are but instruments used with bad intensions.
All GOOD people WILL ABIDE by the Law. Including 'Gun Laws'
It is the BAD GUYS who will NOT ABIDE the laws including 'Gun Laws'..... All Laws.
Hense, they are deemed to be Bad Guys.
Any new Laws implemented, will be followed by the Good Guys.
All existing & new Laws implemented will be ignored by The Bad Guys.
Hense, they are deemed to be Bad Guys.
Countries in Asia & Europe with Laws prohibiting Firearms possession & ownership, have fatal crimes committed by BAD GUYS using 'Other deadly weapons' fashioned from normal daily used household chemicals & items.
FEAR NOT the Gun but the Bullet
FEAR MOST the BAD Person behind them BOTH.
Removing & disarming the people is not the sole solution. The bad guys will acquire the Firearms from illegal sources. Should removing the firearm from the people becomes law. The good guys will be left defenseless, against their would be assailants ie. BADIES.
A politician, I'm NOT. I, along with numerous others do not have any idea or good solution. However, we can agree there is no one good solution including imposing more laws; Worse yet, disarming the people is NOT a solution.
I'm not a gun owner, I am not a firearm enthusiast. I'm a simpleton who respect both the people of this great country & the best Constitution in the world. Including the 2nd. amendment along with and including many other great amendments in our Constitution.
Sorry for my long post. I'll write a shorter post for my next cyber soap box irreverent.
Have a good day.
Regards
Rory
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Sorry I mis typed the word 'sword'
not the error 'sward'. My fingers don't work well when typing
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wow
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Why cant we raise the age limit on an AR-15 type of rifle to 21 years old.? That would've stopped
him from making the purchase on his 18th birthday. Just this one change..? or is delaying an 18 year old his AR-!5 an erosion of the 2nd amendment..?
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@MBC2000
increasing the age limit from 18 to 21 is hyprocritical. How can you say on one hand it's okay for an 18 year old to go into the military be given actual military weaponry and then shipped off to some foreign theater to fight and to kill and potentially die fighting some war, But at the same time that person is not responsible enough to own a weapon, for his or her own defense.
Maturity is not an age issue it's an issue of being raised properly in a good home and being thought life skills, so that a person knows how to handle themselves in the real world. I have met 40 year olds who are not capable of this.
@MBC2000 have you ever considered that maybe, just maybe the problem is not the guns but there are cultural and social issues within our society that are behind alot of these incidents.
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i'm good with raising the age on lots of shit...calfornia just made it 21 to become a cop
the military can be the exception...they are WITH the little fuckers day and night and KNOW the mental makeup of that person. they get ample weapons training and typically in the military until after the age of 21. if the person is a military WASHOUT...the letter from the military might say keep guns from this lil fucker
maybe have a few exceptions to the 21...extensive training...maybe a security job?
there IS that part once they get in? they keep going/pushing until all the guns are gone or the goal of something like that
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The Deep State Democrats just want to take guns away... period.
If everyone has guns they cant force their authoritarian bullshit onto the masses. This is the plan.
They dont care about people affected by these shootings.
Kinda funny how the media cant focus on the epidemic with fentanyl overdoses or the mass quantities of illegal everything flowing accross the southern border.
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Another shooting today...
Almost like the riots of 2020...
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