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Russian oligarchs will have Putin assassinated if decided to go all out war.
They already pissed enough already with the shit he has caused. Biden is calling his bluff.
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Biden shouldn't back down now. YES , call his bluff. Biden has a bigger red button on his desk. And his works. haha trumptards.
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People forget that JFK was pretty tough with Russia going toe to toe and almost making the first move in nuclear war.
He didn’t want war but knew being a push over was not an option.
Putin really wants you to believe he is willing to bri g down the world in flames if he doesn’t get what he wants.
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but war with Iran is ok? S. Korea??
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Btw I would like to know what is the compromise here in regards to Ukraine and Russia.
Russia for months denied preparations to invade Ukraine. I don’t remember any demands or warnings Russia made against Ukraine. At least Bush gave Saddam a couple days to surrender Iraq before invading. This was a straight out of aggression by Russia. If they want peace they can simply cease fire and retreat.
Russia citizens and its mob oligarchs are turning on Putin.
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'People forget that JFK was pretty tough with Russia going toe to toe and almost making the first move in nuclear war.'
JFK made the first move by making a deal with Khrushchev that he'd pull the missiles out of Turkey but Khrushchev would have to pull them out of Cuba.
THAT's how war with russia was avoided, and JFK made the first move. He didn't spew rhetoric or call him a 'madman' or say 'he's got to go' etc.
Instead now you have every person in dc spewing some bullshit about 'he's bluffing' etc. First he's a madman now he's bluffing? Add to that it was the U.S. that quashed a deal that was almost in place and brokered by Turkey that would have stopped this war before it even happened. The idiots in dc & biden etal. WANTED a confrontation with russia!
How would we react if canada or mexico made an alliance with russia or china? It's the same thing with Ukraine joining nato since it's right on russia's border.
When the old soviet republic fell Gorbachev told the U.S. he was willing to dismantle the Warsaw Pact IF the U.S. would agree to NOT expand nato. They agreed and even signed a treaty promising no expansion of nato. Every president starting with clinton has expanded nato.
You think he's bluffing? You really want to find out? Why is the U.S. buying radiation meds? Why are there psa's on what to do when a nuke goes off?
If it's a bluff then why's the U.S. taking it seriously?
A humiliating defeat is what dc wants. A nuclear war WILL be the out come.
And the people that think this war's a good idea can then scream and cry 'but he was bluffing' all you want when the announcement that 'missiles are inbound this is not a drill' comes across your phone.
Ask the people of Hawaii how they felt when they got that message in 2018.
Atticus Finch
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So how much is the Kremlin paying you exactly? I hope it is enough to cover the pearls you are clutching. Faggot coward traitor.
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'Btw I would like to know what is the compromise here in regards to Ukraine and Russia.'
The deal that was brokered by Turkey and was almost signed, before biden etal. got involved and quashed it, was fairly simple - Putin agreed to pull back his troops while Ukraine agreed to let the Dobresk region go to russia.
Keep in mind that the people of the Dobresk region are ethnic russians and that they'd actually held an election to decide whether to remain Ukrainian or go with russia. It was overwhelmingly for going with russia. This was just after the U.S. sponsored coup that installed zelinsky.
Atticus Finch
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'So how much is the Kremlin paying you exactly? I hope it is enough to cover the pearls you are clutching. Faggot coward traitor.'
Wow, I'm so impressed with such an intelligent response ... bravo.
But since your calling me a traitor that means that - We actually are at war with russia.
And, using that amazingly small intellect of yours, you've come to the idiotic conclusion that that's a good idea.
Amazing.
Atticus Finch
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Ah yes. The good ol agreement to allow a dictator to take a big chunk of a country for no exchange other than a weak promise to not cause more shit.
Cause it worked so great in the past for other countries!
Russia annexing that region was very unpopular with Ukrainians.
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Are we forgetting the Bay of Pigs, where JFK tried to have Castro assassinated?
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Not at all. Did he make mistakes? Absolutely. But did he at least try to mitigate them? I'd say yes.
He was the first president to sign a test ban treaty. Met directly with Khrushchev and understood the consequences of the us and russia going to war.
I don't think the people in dc right this minute are even considering that possibility because they're so focused on some 'manifest destiny' bullshit.
I also think that they actually have some insane idea that a nuclear war can be won.
We're supposed to be evolving for the better but EVERYONE in the late 50's and in the 60's knew it meant mutually assured distruction - MAD.
Atticus Finch
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Btw missing a huge element here.
Russia is losing the war in Ukraine. And by many accounts he has already lost.
The only reason you talking about compromise is because Putin is threatening nuclear confrontation. Making compromise out of fear and threat is never a good thing cause he will do this all the time.
Putin know he is a mutual assured destruction pact with USA. It’s the end for him for him as well. I think Putin would rather spend the rest of his days with his billions of dollars and Russian models then be dead.
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'Russia is losing the war in Ukraine. And by many accounts he has already lost.'
In a way you're correct.
But the war would have never happened if the U.S. hadn't gotten involved and quashed the negotiations, especially since there was almost a deal in place.
'The only reason you talking about compromise is because Putin is threatening nuclear confrontation. Making compromise out of fear and threat is never a good thing cause he will do this all the time.'
Actually no it's not. But I do see what the possible outcome will be if we continue to back putin into a corner and his only option is humiliating defeat or start throwing nukes. I'll bet he'll opt for nukes.
Too, this war started LONG before february - it started when the U.S., i.e. clinton, broke it's promise and the treaty that said they wouldn't expand nato. Then clinton and every president after expanded nato to the point that it almost surrounds russia. That's the us and nato threatening russia's security. Throw in the us sponsored overthrow of the previous ukraine government because they wanted it in nato and you've got yourself a mess.
The us has been acting like a bully and the neocon idiots in washington have been spoiling for a fight with russia since clinton.
The us created this mess and the neocons wanted a confrontation with russia. Now it's here and we may not live to see the out come of this idiocy.
Atticus Finch
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Right. Blame Biden and NATO for Russia’s acts of aggression towards a country that doesn’t want to be under its yoke ever again.
You have to consider what former Warsaw Pact and ex-Soviet Republics wanted after the end of the Cold War. They lived under Russia’s dominance for at least 40 years, and the last thing they wanted was the potential for that to happen again. They were beyond eager to join NATO, and Thank God they did, because their membership is what’s going to deter Putin from direct action against them.
I think the historical analogy to Kennedy is incorrect. Rather Putin’s talk of using nuclear weapons reminds me of the early 1980’s when the new Reagan administration felt that the Soviet Union was considering a possible winnable nuclear war, and the Reagan administration began contemplating the same thing. Reagan talked about the possibility of having exchanges of tactical nuclear weapons in the battlefield. Tensions in the early to mid eighties between the two Superpowers ran very high until Russian leadership changed with the ascendancy of Mikhail Gorbachev.
Now some point to the Reagan administration as being highly irresponsible. Others think this “crazy like a fox” mentality may have pushed the Soviet Union towards a younger, more vital leader in Gorbachev after the long run of Leonid Brezhnev.
It’s very plausible Putin is acting “crazy like a fox” to scare the West, including MAGA people like the OP, into getting all strung out about this, to put pressure on leaders of the West to back off from supporting Ukraine. I call a bluff. There’s a very big difference between supporting Ukraine so Putin does not win there and supporting regime change in Russia. We are not threatening the latter, and Putin, more than anything, wants to survive and remain the Russian ruler. Nuclear war puts that very much in doubt.
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Okay well you're wrong.
1) not a maga guy.
2) surrounding russia with nato is a direct threat. If not then invite russia into nato - then it becomes a security matter and not a confrontational one.
Same as it would be a direct threat to the us if canada &/or mexico entered into a strategic alliance with russia or mexico. Or cuba as in JFK's time.
3) It seems like putin believes that the 'west' is out to wipe russia as we know it off the map.
Maybe he's wrong. But it doesn't matter if he's wrong or right. Only matters what he believes and if that's what he believes the possibility of him using nukes increases. Doesn't matter if they're 'tactical' to start it leads to the same outcome.
Atticus Finch
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Valid point AF. This is an issue that George Kennan warned about at the dawn of NATO expansion and John Mearsheimer has put forth some persuasive arguments about the origins/blame for the war and the potential for a nuclear catastrophe, Gotta believe that the folks at NSC and Defense are strategizing all the time about how to avoid a nuclear escalation. I don't think Putin would use tactical nuclear weapons, even a "demonstration" project, without buy in from the Chinese and Indians. Doesn't appear he has been successful in this endeavor. Of course, you want to do everything possible to prevent nuclear escalation, on the other hand you don't want a country to believe they can achieve their objectives by threatening with nukes. Have to think about the Pakis, Indians, North Koreans and, in the future, the Iranians. The scholars of how to wars end are pretty pessimistic about a quick end to the Ukrainian war. When I ask my friends in the intelligence and defense community they just shrug. I haven't heard any good ideas that would be acceptable to the West and Russia for ending the war and achieving a sustainable peace. Just a very glum situation.
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I only have one, whether it pertains To this discussion or not… Biden has fucked up everything he has touched in the last two years! He’s been on the wrong side of every fucking decision for the last 50 years in politics… That’s not debatable that is a pure fact!
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Typical one way reply.
Can anyone cone up with president who hasn't screwed something up.
You fucks act like it's a cake walk. Everyone has an agenda on how to run this USA.
Like dude said Biden fucked up.....well so did Trump. The guy got laughed at G7.
The guy is still holding onto top secret NKorea and China documents. As a Trump card. Some thing Henan use top stir up more shit. Face it! He wants to be another Stalin. What part can you not see. Seems like everyday his inner circle turns on him. Are they lying too.?
Now he's thinking of Marjorie Taylor as a running mate. He threatened Mike Pence to not run.
Trump Taylor 2024. Oh My Fucking God. White House / White Trash. Next you'll see the Beast parked on the grass. The Secret Service riding in F250s with Trump flags and 33 inch mud tires.
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Quat, John Mearsheimer is a smart realpolitik guy, but he's wrong on who started the Ukrainian crisis, etc.... I've linked an excellent debate that has him and Stephen Walt debating Ambassador Michael McFaul and Radosław Sikorski, who was involved in getting Poland to join NATO (and I think is the husband of Anne Applebaum).
The truth is Putin invaded Ukraine primarily because he wants to bring back the old glory of the Russian/Soviet Empire, not because he feels threatened by NATO. That is a red herring.
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Given that none of this opining means shit
We're either getting nuked or not
LA already looks like it got nuked, so what does it matter?
Couple more homeless and no more Tommy's Burgers.
Pfftt...
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Had heard this debate and agree the NATO thing is bullshit
Somebody please tell me which countries NATO has invaded???
Where's the threat?
This is just Russia doing what it's done for a thousand years
The Federation is composed of 21 indigenous area that are slowly saying "no mas"
Yakutia, Chechnya, the Tatars of Crimea and others are now saying, we met our quota
We're not sending any more of our people to fight a Russian war
Russian population is in decline while autonomous areas are still growing
This was Putin's method of thinning those people and bringing some Russian (Ukrainian) blood in
The guys a nut, thinks Russian blood is sacred and needs saving (read his speeches)
Ironically, the guy who wanted to return Russia to glory
Will be the guy that finally destroys it
Hope he doesn't take us with him, skinny little bitch
Well, he can have LA....
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energy control for russia was the number one reason
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Since FJB fucks everything he touches up?
Unemployment figures are down in So Cal. Go Joe!
Back to Russia. Keep the pressure on Joe. Stay the course!
Send those commy bastards to commy hell. We need a good war to show the world the military might the USA has. Flex your muscle Joe.
And drop a great big fat one on them goddam Saudis. Turn them sand nigars into shiny specks of glass. Threatening us with unified terrorism.
Fucking cowards afraid of a Lil ol WW3. We are already fighting WW3 suckers. Iran already has troops in Russia working the drones. China will soon if not already send 100,000 private military mercs to replenish Putin tin soldiers.
FJB you white devil you. And I thought you were a push over.
Have a wonderful weekend and Happy Halloween keep buying shit you don't need like bags of candy and worthless costumes. Practicing your pagan rituals you godless heathens. Without a care in the world while millions don't even have fresh water to drink or a warm bed to sleep in.
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This war will end in negotiations someday. It will be in accord with the Minsk agreements and the Turkish brokered treaty. The obvious goal of the Biden admin is to weaken Russia militarily and economically. So no big incentive for the US to broker a peace even though many more Ukrainians will die and the countrys infrastructure damaged.
The US wants to dramatically increase its hegemony in the area thru its direction of NATO and a.weakened Russia is l essential.
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| There are 25 comments on this blog. |
